Eilistraee

jameslt0 · Post by **jameslt0** » Fri Mar 14, 2008 7:29 pm

I have just started reading the Lady Pentient series that Lisa Smedman is writting. I am on the 2nd book now. I have looked over the forums for an answer, and could not really find one to my question. Is Eilistraee going to stay CG or will she have an alignment shift? Or is alignment really going to be an issue in 4e? I have heard that they are trying to get away from the current alignment system. I know one thing, I am worried about her having Vhaerun, she will become...to much like him.

Ix'Chimalxochitzin · Post by **Ix'Chimalxochitzin** » Fri Mar 14, 2008 9:59 pm

Never read those books myself, but when i look at the recent changes in the D&D system they're already releasing a lot of alignment restrictions.

[url:2m7f4sb3]http://dnd.wikia.com/wiki/Dungeons_and_Dragons_4[/url:2m7f4sb3]

....O...kay. The first thing going through my mind right now is 'Arcade'. From the looks of it, they've simplified the system quite a bit, which can be both a good or a bad thing. True, it was kind of hard for a new player to make their first character, but imho this is going to slaughter the adaptility to House Rules.

As for me, i like having a ton of options, juggling through chapters to build and plan me a character up to Epic levels. Oh, and btw...

Elves are now a crossbreed between Wild Elves and fey. And 'to be treated as eladrin in terms of game mechanics' (Outsiders!)

I'm... going to have to see how this turns out...

Thalon Mercrow · Post by **Thalon Mercrow** » Sat Mar 15, 2008 2:32 am

to qoute starwars "i have a bad feeling about this"

jameslt0 · Post by **jameslt0** » Sat Mar 15, 2008 3:25 pm

[quote="Ix'Chimalxochitzin":2hzpszjz]Elves are now a crossbreed between Wild Elves and fey. And 'to be treated as eladrin in terms of game mechanics' (Outsiders!)[/quote:2hzpszjz]

Whisky Tango Foxtrot or WTF! Elves are NOT Outsiders. I don't think they should even be native Outsiders. They are .... Elves.

CrankyOzzie · Post by **CrankyOzzie** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 8:30 am

If you read any backstory to 3/3.5 edition, Elves where brought to Faerun from another world. Just as the orcs where, just as some human races were.

Still.. considering Elves and Orcs were brought to Faerun about 40,000 years or so ago, then yes, any (read: all) born in that time should be considered natives.

Ix'Chimalxochitzin · Post by **Ix'Chimalxochitzin** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 12:09 pm

Agreed. And since half-Drow breed back into a true Drow, it's safe to assume the same would be true for half-elves as well. Only when really stretching it could they be called half-Outsiders at best due to 40,000 years of crossbreeding.

Thalon Mercrow · Post by **Thalon Mercrow** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 9:43 pm

actully i belive all elves came to farun except for us wood elfs who were hear first.that is if my reserch is corrcet,

Thalon Mercrow · Post by **Thalon Mercrow** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 9:52 pm

ah-ha! i knew i was right after about 1 or 2 mins of research i found evedence to support my claim BEHOLD!!!!!!!

According to Races of FaerÃ»n (which was published in March 2003 and only mentions aquatic elves, avariel, drow, lythari, moon elves, sun elves, wood elves, and wild elves), wood elves are the only elven subrace that is native to Toril. They slowly formed for centuries from some of the other elven subraces after the last Crown War. They see their realms as the natural successors to past nations such as Eaerlann and Cormanthyr.

jameslt0 · Post by **jameslt0** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 10:59 pm

Look in the Unapproachable East for information on Star Elves. Those ARE, I believe, outsiders.

Thalon Mercrow · Post by **Thalon Mercrow** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 4:47 am

well them and ghost elves.

Talwyn Aureliano · Post by **Talwyn Aureliano** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 6:06 am

I'm all for diversity but after a while it gets a bit silly with so many types of elves, don't you think?

I mean how many subspecies can be thought up?

With all the myriad of elves, they are going to start running out of adjectives to use for new subspecies in the not to distant future.

My suggestions will be as follows:

Gimp Elves
Snot Elves
Earwax Elves
Naval Lint Elves
Elves with Hallitosis
Elves who only like the colour blue

and of course
Absurd Elves

Argoth · Post by **Argoth** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 11:05 am

The world is changing... Have to get into those changes to make up my mind.

CrankyOzzie · Post by **CrankyOzzie** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 12:33 pm

rofl @ Talwyn's suggestions. Never know, some people might play those variants

But yeah, too many options are just as bad as not enough. Personally, I think Elves should be ... Elves, Drow Elves. "Racial" differences should be in direct relation to their environment. eg: Swedish people, though Caucasian, are obviously going to be able to withstand cold better than an Australian, in general. If a certain tribe of Elves has lived in the Spine of the world for millennia, sure, give them resistant to cold, make them hardier than their sword coast cousins. But why should they be a different race entirely?

There is a very obvious difference between Drow and normal Elves, just as there is a very obvious difference between negroids and caucasians, or caucasians and asians, or asians and polynesians. But german isn't THAT much different from a Frenchman, Swedish, or even englishman. They all share the same basic genetics, but regional differences in climate tend to produce slight differences.

And I just KNOW I spelt cuacaisians wrong at least once >_>

Talwyn Aureliano · Post by **Talwyn Aureliano** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 12:52 pm

Heh, I do my best to please

Having subrace types is ok but it would take a long time for such adaptations to occur which would make them different from the original gene stock. Drow are the best example in that they left the main branch of elves right from the very start of the elves as a race thus have had millenia to become the subrace type they are.

I think the only other true subrace type of elves that should be allowed in campaign settings are aquatic elves and even then I'm a bit leery in letting them in. After all, they are pretty hopeless on land and hardly any land based race, elven or otherwise, has major access to water breathing magic so this sort of makes the sea elves "fish out of water"

Further suggestions for silly elven subrace typoes:

Underpants Elves [they don't believe in underpants

]
Chocolate Elves [ a delcious race of edible elves that live in terror of hot days]
Yuppie Elves [ they get high paying jobs and move into funky inner city apartments and talk about money all the time]

Post by **Shir'le E. Illios** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 2:08 pm

I think there are that many different subraces of elves because people have been treating subraces somewhat similar to cultural variants. The only thing being that since subraces have stat differences people have been creating many cultural variances of elves with stat differences.

Of course the whole difference between race, subrace and cultural variant are pretty muddled to begin with.

I think that's why 4E is doing away with subraces. Instead there are three races of elf (as far as I know): elves, eladrin and drow. Elves are what used to be wood elves and green/wild elves, while Eladrin are what used to be sun elves, moon elves and star elves. Both these races are player races, with drow being introduced as player races with the Forgotten Realms setting. I'd expect there to still be a concept of sun elves and moon elves, but it'll be cultural only (and maybe some slight visual differences) and [i:25xdo0a4]not[/i:25xdo0a4] have any stat differences anymore.

I also just found a very interesting article on elves in 4E, but I'll make a separate news post for it.

As for the original question; I'm not sure. I do get the feeling that they're moving Eilistraee more towards Chaotic Neutral. But in general I also get the impression that they're moving away (in 4E) from specifying alignment as strictly as they did before (which probably means that a lot of aligned characters and deities are going to feel neutral instead). They could make Eilistraee "unaligned", though I personally rather strongly hope that she remains good. Eilistraee being good is, for me, one of her primary defining traits and if they change that it wouldn't be Eilistraee anymore.

But yeah, I get the feeling that they're placing Eilistraee between Lolth's (and thus that of most drow) evil and the 'good' of the other Elves/Eladrin.

Love -x-x-x-

Shir'le