Glacier's Edge: BEHOLD Ultimate Wkar's GREATEST ENEMY The Aevendrow

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Leema Har'gachi
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Glacier's Edge: BEHOLD Ultimate Wkar's GREATEST ENEMY The Aevendrow

Post by Leema Har'gachi »

So I finished reading Glacier edge yesterday and well, there is so much wrong there. Where to start, well the Aevendrow and all of Callidae are horrible, horrible people which I will get into in a little bit. Irennan was indeed correct with the Eilistraee reference that wouldn’t be much a single sentence in fact in the last 80 pages of the book where “Holy” Galathae prays to Eilistraee to heal another aevendrow and in the character description in the back of the refers to her as “Paladin of Eilistraee, Galathae is a leader in the defenses of Callidae and was instrumental in accepting the four strangers – jarlaxle, catti-brie, artemis entreri, and zaknafein – who happened upon the city.” Holy is in quotes up there as that is a title and not really her name, just like how Valrissa Zhamboule name is always written as Mona Valrissa Zhamboule, “mona” is her title and there needs to be a difference there either with quote or italics to show the reader that these are titles and not their proper name. The book is split evenly into three main plots, the Menzobrerranzan “Civil War” which now has boiled into physical conflict (though no open declaration of war); Azzudonna, the southern trying to figure out where she came from, and drizzt’s arc as a monk where he ends the book as a 15th level 1st edition monk and I know this because Kane literally has Drizzt duel him, though we aren’t shown who won, the drow rangers rather smug smile makes it very clear he did win the duel (though Kane made drizzt promise to never challenge the Master of winter, who kane knows will become the new Grandmaster of Flowers); The last plot revolves around Galathae and the other Callidae, basically what they do after jarlaxle returns south, however this plot is actually spread thought the whole book in short two to three page section and also highlights why the Aevendrow are even worse than Lolthites.
For starts this who Aevendrow arc is complete pointless, because the only reason why the Slaad are even a threat is because the Aevendrow refuse to mass a army to assault Ygorl’s fortress as the final half of the book reveals, there is only about 50 slaad and frost giants total, that not 50 slaad and 50 frost giants, no no no, that is between the slaadi and frost giants there is only 50 of them total not counting Ygorl who they could still drive back if not kill with a large enough army, WHICH THEY HAVE! True the N’divi and the undead do make things a little more in Ygorl’s favor, but not enough for him to beat a army of Aevendrow (though there are hints that none of the Aevendrow are above 9th level). Still Ygorl’s army was easily beaten by twelve adventures, though they didn’t beat Ygorl that was Qdeej under the request of Pikal of all people. Oh yeah, apparently Pikal still has access to ALL of his 1st edition spells and spells that clearly never existed ever, like a endure elements spell that can last all day and night long, worse Pikal cast three 7th level spells mean he not only still a 1st edition druid (or Doo-dad as he likes to call it) he at least a GREAT DRUID, I.E. a Maxed out pre-unearthed arcana druid. ARRRRAAAAAGGHHHH!!!
Now, this is why the Aevendrow are horrible people not only do they rip your memories of Callidae from your mind, which Kimmuriel explains as your memory being a ever expanding length of rope that someone cut a massive length of it out and then stitch together the two cut off ends back together as if nothing had happened, then throw again the removed section, but they literally leave anyone who goes to the fortress to die no matter what, they refuse to fight the slaadi unless they directly enter Callidae territory which they call “trying to Survive” keep in mind that they could literally remove the Slaadi from the north with easy, oh and their so called Paladin of Eilistraee is the worst of them. Heres why, normally when one of Eilistraee’s cleric comes against overwhelming force and several of their member are captures, they will yes retreat, but they will comeback in force to overwhelm the enemy force and retrieve their lost comrade wither alive or dead. Not only is Galathae ok with the councils decision not try to rescue Azzudonna (who they believe was killed by Gwen) or any of Team Jarlaxle, Galathae (who actually doesn’t know if any of them are actually dead or not because she didn’t see jack shit) flat out told Mona Valrissa and the council that they should further double down on forbidding anyone for going to the fortress again, even after Jarlaxle returns alive and informs them that everyone who was ever captured by the Slaadi are in frozen mounds alive back in the fortress, she tells him to his face they will never, ever! Let him go back to attempt a rescue, this is why Jarlaxle lets them mindwipe him. This is stupid, He made the Aevendrow even worse than the Lolthites, even they would go to rescue fallen comrades and if they were dead, they would at least avenge them. Callidae won’t do that and won’t even fight their enemy who they are very capable of destroying with easy and this isn’t just from a narrative perspective either as a lot of the book goes out of its way to fallow 1st edition rules (which rob has stated multiple times is the only edition he likes) with a couple exceptions where he ignores rules for a narrative reason I.E. he wants drizzt to be a grandmaster of Flowers, but not be tied to the monastery or how he gave Pikal a spell that doesn’t exists how he describes it in any edition , but by all mechanical game logic Ygorl could easily be beating by the 21-30th level Magic-user Gromph (his level varies between the two a lot between editions), the 19th level range/ 9th level fighter/ 3rd level barbarian and now /15th level monk Drizzt, 20th level Thief Jarlaxle, and 14th level Great Druid Doo-Dad Pikal let along a couple 100, level 3-9 aevendrow regardless of class. This story arc just doesn’t work, it never WILL… WORK… Avoid this trilogy as I sure that last book will be even worse, the last book was boring this book just made me violently omnicidally angry, there is only one good part in the whole book when Kimmuriel takes Jarlaxle to the hive mind and meets the Mind Flayer who was the GHOST KING and he is fucking hilarious and we find out the whole of the Mind Flayer hive mind are scared shitless of Jarlaxle because and I quote “He fornicates with dragons!” I was laughing the whole time the GHOST KING was on screen (so to speak).
Also Its official, I HATE THE AEVENDROW, I also hate the Lorendrow, but that because they have my FUCKING NAME IN THEIRS and I do not want to be associated with them at all and yes, my real name is Loren.
So I appoligize for the rant, but I needed to vent this out. Feel free to give feedback or state your own feels on the matter.
CODENAME:Leema
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Re: Glacier's Edge: BEHOLD Ultimate Wkar's GREATEST ENEMY The Aevendrow

Post by Bhaern Quel »

I am sorry to know you purchased a book by RAS, by now we already knew he was not Eilistraee friendly.

I have seen another preview, that was not kind at all either.

I find it hard that any Paladin would advise against fighting evil, though of course should warn weak to avoid. Until the strong could remove.

There again there has become an expectation on my part to avoid RAS writings because of his focus on his story and mostly disregard for the shared world lore.

There again WotC appears not too much care about the shared realm lore.
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Re: Glacier's Edge: BEHOLD Ultimate Wkar's GREATEST ENEMY The Aevendrow

Post by Leema Har'gachi »

Bhaern Quel wrote: Tue Aug 16, 2022 2:55 am I am sorry to know you purchased a book by RAS, by now we already knew he was not Eilistraee friendly.

I have seen another preview, that was not kind at all either.

I find it hard that any Paladin would advise against fighting evil, though of course should warn weak to avoid. Until the strong could remove.

There again there has become an expectation on my part to avoid RAS writings because of his focus on his story and mostly disregard for the shared world lore.

There again WotC appears not too much care about the shared realm lore.
Yeah, I've unfortunately have developed a burning hatred for WOTC. I'm mean 4th Edition was a Tactical Wargame (at least as a wargame it was good and could standout on its own away from the D&D brand) marketed as a role playing game and 5th edition is a Super hero action adventure game with no internal narrative let alone a setting or narrative mechanic in it (worse 5th edition is just a skeleton with nothing of substance or interesting on it own in it, if you take away the brand name, the game is doing nothing special, what it does do it does terribly, and it just doesn't standout on its own) also marketed as a role playing game. It kind of makes me regret becoming a game designer when their are game designers out their making game that are of a genre that they are not being marketed as. I personally don't have too much problem with Rob making a self contained story in the realms, my problem is when he goes out of his way to references something (like Eilistraee or drow history in general) out side of his self contained story and does it poorly. I feel like I need a hug.... and maybe a pacifier.
CODENAME:Leema
Real Name:Leema Apollyon Har'gachi
Class:Variant Illusionist Favored Soul {gestalt}
Race:Shadow Drow
Height:5'8"
Weight:158 Ib.
Hair:Yellowish
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Skin:Pitch-black(surrounded by Shadowy Purple Aura)
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Re: Glacier's Edge: BEHOLD Ultimate Wkar's GREATEST ENEMY The Aevendrow

Post by Irennan »

Eh, it's a Salvatore book. Dude admitted that he doesn't do any planning for his stories, he just goes "with the flow", and if his flow needs a character to act ooc, he just tries to come up with a justification. His stories have no structure, no transformation arcs, no main driving theme whatsoever. Of course this arc is pointless, because there's no meaningful transformation of any character--and there hasn't been any since forever. You could say that there's no arc, in narrative terms.

When I learned that Eilistraee was mentioned in his book, I was skeptical and had some fear that he would slander her faith, and looks like he did after all. BUT, I'm glad that he's giving his awesome utopia of awesomeness at least one flaw. Even though I'm not sure he sees it as such, or that it was his goal (remember when he "redeemed" Entreri, a trauma victim, through insane torture and fear to go to hell? Yeah, that was portrayed as an actual redemption, so as a good thing).

Also, *hugs*
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Re: Glacier's Edge: BEHOLD Ultimate Wkar's GREATEST ENEMY The Aevendrow

Post by Leema Har'gachi »

Irennan wrote: Wed Aug 17, 2022 4:07 am Eh, it's a Salvatore book. Dude admitted that he doesn't do any planning for his stories, he just goes "with the flow", and if his flow needs a character to act ooc, he just tries to come up with a justification. His stories have no structure, no transformation arcs, no main driving theme whatsoever. Of course this arc is pointless, because there's no meaningful transformation of any character--and there hasn't been any since forever. You could say that there's no arc, in narrative terms.

When I learned that Eilistraee was mentioned in his book, I was skeptical and had some fear that he would slander her faith, and looks like he did after all. BUT, I'm glad that he's giving his awesome utopia of awesomeness at least one flaw. Even though I'm not sure he sees it as such, or that it was his goal (remember when he "redeemed" Entreri, a trauma victim, through insane torture and fear to go to hell? Yeah, that was portrayed as an actual redemption, so as a good thing).

Also, *hugs*
Yeah, you were indeed correct. I'm pretty sure the "flaw" wasn't intentional, he probably doesn't even think of it as a flaw. Thanks for the hug Irennan, I need that. Between everything 5th edition, WOTC, and this; it definitely makes one... dead inside?
CODENAME:Leema
Real Name:Leema Apollyon Har'gachi
Class:Variant Illusionist Favored Soul {gestalt}
Race:Shadow Drow
Height:5'8"
Weight:158 Ib.
Hair:Yellowish
Eyes:Purple(pinwheel)
Skin:Pitch-black(surrounded by Shadowy Purple Aura)
Deity:Eilistraee
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Re: Glacier's Edge: BEHOLD Ultimate Wkar's GREATEST ENEMY The Aevendrow

Post by Irennan »

Watching something you're passionate about being crapped upon definitely makes you feel a sense of emptiness. But I learned to stop caring about D&D, I only care that Eilistraee's back and she's been included in the new lore. That means that people will read her name and look up her lore if they're interested, and see what she stands for, include her in their campaigns, and so on... And there's A LOT of info about her online, which is also easily accessible, complete, and accurately reflects Eilistraee (the Wiki). Knowing that makes me feel good, and is enough to defuse the sense of emptiness that comes from seeing the abysmal quality of the new FR stories (with the bonus fuzzy feeling of being one of the people that worked on spreading Eilistraee's lore over the wiki and other platforms).
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Re: Glacier's Edge: BEHOLD Ultimate Wkar's GREATEST ENEMY The Aevendrow

Post by Leema Har'gachi »

Irennan wrote: Thu Aug 18, 2022 10:24 pm Watching something you're passionate about being crapped upon definitely makes you feel a sense of emptiness. But I learned to stop caring about D&D, I only care that Eilistraee's back and she's been included in the new lore. That means that people will read her name and look up her lore if they're interested, and see what she stands for, include her in their campaigns, and so on... And there's A LOT of info about her online, which is also easily accessible, complete, and accurately reflects Eilistraee (the Wiki). Knowing that makes me feel good, and is enough to defuse the sense of emptiness that comes from seeing the abysmal quality of the new FR stories (with the bonus fuzzy feeling of being one of the people that worked on spreading Eilistraee's lore over the wiki and other platforms).
What new lore, everything I seen them release for 5th edition has virtually nothing about Eilistraee, her goals, views, religion organization? The only things I've seen them release was her name, divine rank, portfolios (which is down to three for some reason), Domains (which again there is only three for some reason), and her alignment. I guess my problem is I'm looking at all of this through a game designers prospective who loved AD&D 1st edition, so when I see something released for a "role playing game" I expecting way more work put into all the setting designed for the game. Oh, who am I kidding, WOTC don't design game settings they just try shoving pre-existing setting into a game that is very clearly not designed to handle them. Sorry, I know your trying to look at the bright side of things, but every time I look at them and their products all I see are some pretty bad game designer floating around a Big Black Abyss of Death. In the Lady Silverhair's name I can't see anying but darkness.
CODENAME:Leema
Real Name:Leema Apollyon Har'gachi
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Height:5'8"
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Re: Glacier's Edge: BEHOLD Ultimate Wkar's GREATEST ENEMY The Aevendrow

Post by Irennan »

By "new lore" I mean that Eilistraee is still there even with this new "aevendrow, lorendrow, udadrow" retcon. So people will read her name, and if they're interested, they'll look up more info on her. Most people who want more info about Eilistraee flock to the wiki, and it's cool because the wiki page on Eilistraee is reliable.

As for the designers, yeah, they make what earns them money. They're a company, companies prefer to put out a lower quality product that gets bought more than a higher quality product that would have fewer buyers (or that they believe would have fewer buyers, at least). I grew disinterested in D&D and FR, because the new stories were a bunch of tropes slapped together with 0 real narrative. Have you watched the new movie trailer? It's the exact same thing: the characters aren't presented as people with struggles, beliefs, and goals, but as clichés thrown together. The goofy thief, the action girl that is just a "badass" cardboard cutout, etc... Even the advertised plot is filmsy. Everything sounds like an excuse to string a bunch of action scenes and lame jokes together. Granted, maybe the movie will prove me wrong when it's out, but up to now all I heard about it screams "bland, cliché fantasy tropes", just like RAS' stories, just like WotC's new stories. It's all so uninspired, there's no reason to give a single flying. I only care that people get to learn that Eilistraee exists, and have the opportunity to look her up.
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Re: Glacier's Edge: BEHOLD Ultimate Wkar's GREATEST ENEMY The Aevendrow

Post by Leema Har'gachi »

Irennan wrote: Mon Aug 22, 2022 1:32 am By "new lore" I mean that Eilistraee is still there even with this new "aevendrow, lorendrow, udadrow" retcon. So people will read her name, and if they're interested, they'll look up more info on her. Most people who want more info about Eilistraee flock to the wiki, and it's cool because the wiki page on Eilistraee is reliable.
oh, ok yeah that makes sense.
Irennan wrote: Mon Aug 22, 2022 1:32 am As for the designers, yeah, they make what earns them money. They're a company, companies prefer to put out a lower quality product that gets bought more than a higher quality product that would have fewer buyers (or that they believe would have fewer buyers, at least). I grew disinterested in D&D and FR, because the new stories were a bunch of tropes slapped together with 0 real narrative. Have you watched the new movie trailer? It's the exact same thing: the characters aren't presented as people with struggles, beliefs, and goals, but as clichés thrown together. The goofy thief, the action girl that is just a "badass" cardboard cutout, etc... Even the advertised plot is filmsy. Everything sounds like an excuse to string a bunch of action scenes and lame jokes together. Granted, maybe the movie will prove me wrong when it's out, but up to now all I heard about it screams "bland, cliché fantasy tropes", just like RAS' stories, just like WotC's new stories. It's all so uninspired, there's no reason to give a single flying. I only care that people get to learn that Eilistraee exists, and have the opportunity to look her up.
Yeah I watched the trailer, its going to suck most likely, but that makes sense. WOTC doesn't understand what makes a RPG, let alone a good game, so of course they are going to make a not very good movie, based on a property they themselves don't understand. I agree with you.
CODENAME:Leema
Real Name:Leema Apollyon Har'gachi
Class:Variant Illusionist Favored Soul {gestalt}
Race:Shadow Drow
Height:5'8"
Weight:158 Ib.
Hair:Yellowish
Eyes:Purple(pinwheel)
Skin:Pitch-black(surrounded by Shadowy Purple Aura)
Deity:Eilistraee
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Re: Glacier's Edge: BEHOLD Ultimate Wkar's GREATEST ENEMY The Aevendrow

Post by Lesteraction »

I'm referring to the fact that Eilistraee is still present despite the recent "aevendrow, lorendrow, udadrow" retcon. People will see her name, and if they are curious, they will look her up online. As the wiki article on Eilistraee is trustworthy, most individuals who are interested in learning more about it go there.
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