Eilistraee LIVES!

This is the place where the leaders of the Chosen post news. News about the Chosen, news about drow/Eilistraee, news about NWN/NWN2 and news generally considered interesting to us. This is also the place where you can comment on those news items. :rss:

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Bhaern Quel
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Re: Eilistraee LIVES!

Postby Bhaern Quel » Mon Nov 21, 2016 3:49 am

Irennan wrote:On a side note, the part about them being "scantily clad beautiful women", combined with the fact that they are described as weak in power (in battle, they mostly try to turn undead, and cast weak healing spells), does make them look like damsels in distress, and makes no sense within their lore (priestesses of Eilistraee use whatever practial gear that thet can get). That's rather annoying


Yes that bother me a little along with them being Sword Dancers. It did not feel correct as to lore that I recall. There again lore can change at a drop of ink.

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Re: Eilistraee LIVES!

Postby Leonides02 » Sat Jan 21, 2017 8:13 am

You know, I'm sorry the changedance is no longer necessary. I thought that was such a neat, unique, and very pagan feature of the goddess. I think I'll keep it in my game. :)

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Re: Eilistraee LIVES!

Postby Irennan » Sat Jan 21, 2017 3:51 pm

Leonides02 wrote:You know, I'm sorry the changedance is no longer necessary. I thought that was such a neat, unique, and very pagan feature of the goddess. I think I'll keep it in my game. :)


No longer necessary, but not necessarily abolished. The fact that it is no longer necessary is good IMO, because that means that Eilistraee can now more easily bond with males too, while those who want it (be it for personal reasons, or in order to feel closer to Eilistraee) can still undergo the changedance. It leaves more room to choice, which really fits Eilistraee, since she's so big on freedom of expression.

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Re: Eilistraee LIVES!

Postby Irennan » Wed Mar 14, 2018 12:50 am

More news about Eilistraee (and all the drow pantheon) coming soon with the Mordenkainen's Tome of Foes. According to Jeremy Crawford, one of the authors, the book will include in-depth info on all the drow pantheon. Now I'm actually excited to see this (despite his over-emphasizing Drizzt in the first part of the video, he says: "The book goes into a lot of depth about the drow pantheon" at about 6:35).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hgP6JnWh4Ig&feature=youtu.be

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Re: Eilistraee LIVES!

Postby Irennan » Wed Mar 14, 2018 2:10 am

Also, Jeremy Crawford's confirmation (I was going to ask him, but someone preceded me):

https://twitter.com/JeremyECrawford/sta ... 2083945472

Eilistraee will get a nice section just for her, so will the rest (the Vulkoor mentioned in the tweet is the main god of the drow in Eberron).

Bhaern Quel
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Re: Eilistraee LIVES!

Postby Bhaern Quel » Wed Mar 14, 2018 2:25 am

Change Dance a Blessing?

It might be a take away, however I would not hope for much. The book clearly is multi-verse and by such nature offers everything and nothing. What works in Grey Hawk does not always work in Forgotten Realms.

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Re: Eilistraee LIVES!

Postby Irennan » Wed Mar 14, 2018 2:33 am

Bhaern Quel wrote:Change Dance a Blessing?

It might be a take away, however I would not hope for much. The book clearly is multi-verse and by such nature offers everything and nothing. What works in Grey Hawk does not always work in Forgotten Realms.


The ChangeDance has never really been implemented by WotC as published lore. It's only Ed's lore, and he has now clarified that in the current era the ChangeDance is no longer needed, and only optional. I find that new divine blessing quite interesting, tho.

Yes, the book is Multiverse, but they explicitly said that it will include sections regarding each race in the various worlds. The fact that he said in-depth info also makes me think that each deity will receive at least a decent amount of into. As for me, I'm only happy that new D&D/FR fans will get to Eilistraee and how wonderful she is, and that we'll get some updates (and that she's now established as part of the 5e pantheon, without much risk of getting forgotten and swept away, or that her return will be revised).

Besides, FR is now their core world, so there's also that.

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Shir'le E. Illios
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Re: Eilistraee LIVES!

Postby Shir'le E. Illios » Wed Mar 14, 2018 10:55 am

Sounds like it could be quite promising. Thank you. :)

And it does sound like this blessing is something separate from the Change Dance, but quite interesting.


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Re: Eilistraee LIVES!

Postby Irennan » Mon Mar 19, 2018 4:46 am

I've noticed 1 particular thing. That is, in their new lore, the drow weren't cursed. When all the elves lost their connection to Arvandor and lost their shapeshifting abilities, they were crystallized into w/e form they were wearing (or into w/e form was their favorite), that means that the drow have always looked like drow ever since they lost their shapeshifting ability.

I honestly welcome this change, even tho I don't like seeing previous lore being disregarded like this. The idea of a such a curse has always been incredibly lame IMHO, and--most importantly--that BS about brown elves (that has never had anything to do with Eilistraee and cheapened all that she stands for) has now been entirely and unmistakably retconned into oblivion.

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Shir'le E. Illios
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Re: Eilistraee LIVES!

Postby Shir'le E. Illios » Mon Mar 26, 2018 9:54 am

Interesting.

Though I do wonder how that works with the one detail about drow skin color that I did like: that Corellon gave the drow their skin color to show his love for his (then) wife and children (where Araushnee took it as an insult, which added to her eventually betraying the elven deities).

It also makes me wonder if the drow were still cursed (during one of the Crown Wars) to be forced underground. I did have a story for that in mind at one point.

Even so, I do like the approach that it's how they chose to look.


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Re: Eilistraee LIVES!

Postby Irennan » Mon Mar 26, 2018 1:02 pm

Shir'le E. Illios wrote:Interesting.

Though I do wonder how that works with the one detail about drow skin color that I did like: that Corellon gave the drow their skin color to show his love for his (then) wife and children (where Araushnee took it as an insult, which added to her eventually betraying the elven deities).


Maybe that was true in 2e (and in 2e there was no mention of appearance-changing curses, it first appeared in 3e IIRC), but--assuming that it was still true in 3e--in the end-3e/LP version, he could only have done that by making the dark elves brown-skinned. The curse that turned them into black-skinned elves came much later, and had the purpose to "reflect the evil inside" or some other BS like that.

In this version, the drow have always been black-skinned/silver-haired, no appearance-changing curse there. Interestingly, this is perfectly in line with Elaine's Evermeet: Island of Elves (2e). In that book, Araushnee, Eilistraee, and all dark elves are black-skinned from the beginning. But it's no surprise, really, end-3e covered anything good regarding the drow in the previous lore with tons of mud, and intentionally so (Thinking about it, I'm no longer torn over this: it's a good feeling to see the end-3e influence gone. I don't like when previous lore gets dumpstered, but end-3e/LP trashed all that came before, so getting rid of it is for the best).

It also makes me wonder if the drow were still cursed (during one of the Crown Wars) to be forced underground. I did have a story for that in mind at one point.

Even so, I do like the approach that it's how they chose to look.


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Shir'le

According to Lost Empires of Faerun, after the drow were cursed, all of them (including innocents and victims) were forcefully driven underground by the joined forces of all the remaining elven empires. It wasn't magic to drive them down there, but other elves, so that could easily still be true even without appearance-changing curses.

I agree that this is an interesting development, and it gets rid of one of the most hated aspects of the LP books (one that also warped Eilistraee's character and goals).

I'd also like to hear what kind of story you had in mind, if that's possible.

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Re: Eilistraee LIVES!

Postby Shir'le E. Illios » Tue Mar 27, 2018 11:04 am

Irennan wrote:I'd also like to hear what kind of story you had in mind, if that's possible.

At one point I was considering a sort of Eilistraeen 'bible'; a chaotic, unordered collection of legends, songs, recipes, dancing steps, etc.

One of these legends I had in mind was from the time that the drow were forced underground. The way I thought it was that, initially, there was a magical force that pushed down on the drow, forcing them underground (I find it hard to believe that an entire species can be forced underground without magical means). The legend in question was about one Eilistraeen drow woman who utterly refused to go, the magical force pushing her flat onto the ground at some point (and still she refused to go). She lasted like this for something like months or even years (and in typical legend-fashion didn't die from hunger/thirst; maybe the animals took pity on her and helped keep her fed or something, I hadn't decided yet). Then at one point the force suddenly lifted as the magic was spent (and no longer needed as all drow were now underground) and she would then continue to live on the surface, waiting for other drow to move back to the surface and welcome them in Eilistraee's embrace.

Something like that anyway. Was just imagining it as a short story written like a religious legend.

For the book itself, which I imagined would be called the "Moonlight Tome", I imagined that all the pages were scattered around the world in hidden places and players could go and try to hunt them all down, rebuilding the book again. Possibly adding new pages to it as well. The final book would probably have some artifact-type powers, maybe some limited powers when partly filled.

Seemed like a fun idea anyway. :)


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Re: Eilistraee LIVES!

Postby Irennan » Tue Mar 27, 2018 1:11 pm

That sounds like an awesome idea, actually, I really like the concept of this Eilistraeean woman who simply refuses to bend to w/e magic the elves and the Seldarine summoned, defiantly resisting to keep her home. It is doubly interesting to me, because that curse was one of the biggest cases of injustice in the history of the elves and drow (even more so because the followers of Eilistraee, who had already been nearly exterminated with the Dark Disaster, were punished too. Also because Corellon didn't even care about the loss that that meant for his daughter, that she had also been reduced to near powerlessness by such a cataclysm unleashed by the sun elves, leaving the drow without any positive guidance in a time where the Seldarine turned their back on them, and when Lolth had them in her web).

As for driving the drow underground without magical means, I don't believe that *all* drow were driven there. The majority of them were chased down there, but those who remained were also hunted and killed on sight. I think that even those who somehow managed to escape the first purge, in the end sought refuge where most of their people went. Given that Eilistraee is also about sharing the fate of her people, about bringing them her light by being by their side in the darkest moments, I think that even those among her followers who managed to avoid getting exiled chose to reach for the rest of their people trapped underground.

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Re: Eilistraee LIVES!

Postby Zekafae » Tue Apr 17, 2018 5:14 am

Such romantic notions. I'm still alive people, just been slaving away at a world, that needs more writing and a ton of actual art, which I need to do myself to get it close to what I want. Will look into getting it into a dnd setting somehow. But always interesting to see where the story of Eilistraee goes.
Site, story being redone
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http://dragcave.net/user/Zekafae (click please?)

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Re: Eilistraee LIVES!

Postby Irennan » Tue Apr 17, 2018 1:02 pm

Zekafae wrote:Such romantic notions.


Well, given that Eilistraee is quite the romantic goddess, it makes sense.


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