Sex, Marriage and Children

Since the Chosen of Eilistraee is a religious oriented player group, naturally there is a place to have theological discussions. That is in-game religions; please leave real-world religion out of it. Debate the fine points of a certain dogma, how a church can enforce worship while staying true to its tenets or simply why one deity is better than another one is. All are free to talk about it here.

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Avin Jingzu
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Post by Avin Jingzu » Wed Nov 21, 2007 6:49 am

[quote="Yasraena D'issan An'ar"] Twins would be higher than Elven rates, but I would agree with one statement in Flesh of Lolth, twins would be rather destructive to a House and one would be sacrificed immediately. I see Eilistraeen twins being very competitive but also playful and mischevious.[/quote]

While i may be no expert on the matter like the honorable priestess&priest i'd have to agree with you on this one the eilistraeen twins would either be supportive of on another or very competitive (playful and mischevious is almost a given :lol: ) while the stronger or more dominant of the two lolthian twins would survive while it's counterpart is sacrificed...or one just kills the other later.

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Talwyn Aureliano
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Post by Talwyn Aureliano » Tue Apr 01, 2008 3:42 am

I've had a good read through this thread and it raises some interesting points.

In regards to Drow fertility, from what I can recall, the Drow are much more fertile than their surface elven cousins. I think it has something to do with the curse of Lloth and association with spiders [spiders have many young] and since Lloth is a bit of a social darwinist in regards to the honing of her people into the meanest & strongest people there are, it stands to reason that they'd need to prolifigate in their breeding habits. The sheer attrition rate that Llothian Drow society encourages means that they need to be popping out babies in vast numbers to keep replacing all the ones killed.

This goes a long way to explain Drow sexuality and their apparent lustful behaviour. The females can breef up to four times in their life cycle [I think this is mentioned in the books with Liriel?] and that Drow females can actually choose when to concieve a child. During these fertile periods [which we don't know how long they actually last for] we can assume that a Drow woman can have a number of births as she will be seeking to maximise her status as a successful female by having many strong offspring.

We can assume then, that this model of breeding behaviour is extended to Eilistraeen Drow. It makes complete sense that Eilistraeen females would be trying to have large families so as to boost their numbers. Lets face it, Llothians are doing their level best to kill any Drow that dares to flee to Eilistraee. So aside from getting the VERY rare recruit that actually makes it alive to the surface, the Eilistraeen must therefore breed their own population.
Also, as Shir'li has mentioned previously, Drow brought up being spoon feed a certain way of behaving, are hardly likely to give up that behaviour patern overnight. Nor is family planning an issue.

I'd doubt that half drow children would be frowned on either in Eilistraeen society. If a Drow pairs with a non-drow, human, elf etc, then the offspring of that union would be welcomed and cheerished. I think one of Eilistraee's portfolios is childbirthing and mothering and thus all children are precious to her. I'd also say unions between Eilistraeen Drow and non Drow would be not unusual either.

As an aside, I wonder what Eilistraee's relationship is with Hanali Cenail is [elven goddess of love]? I haven't found much material on that but I'd assume that they must get along as they seem to share some ideals/ethics.
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Thalon Mercrow
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Post by Thalon Mercrow » Tue Apr 01, 2008 4:57 am

i think i recall that a drow female can hold off giving birth for at least 3 years if i rember right. also a drows lustful behiaver stems not only from there phisilogly but it's another wepon they use to get ahead in there cutthrot socitey

as for eilisraees relisonship with Hanali Cenail i assume that its preatey much the smae as with the rest of the sedrine if not on better terms scince there ideals are simler as you stated

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Talwyn Aureliano
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Post by Talwyn Aureliano » Tue Apr 01, 2008 10:02 am

Yeah, I'd say that Hanali & Eilistraee do get on with one another but I'd like to see some canon sources which would indicate this.

Heh, I think I'll have to wander over to Candlekeep and ask the Hooded One this question. ;)
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Shir'le E. Illios
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Post by Shir'le E. Illios » Wed Apr 02, 2008 9:39 am

As I understand it Ed Greenwood is tired of answering deity-related questions. Besides, it's likely to change in 4E anyway.

But yes, I can definitely see Eilistraee get it on with Hana... uh, I mean... :tear:


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Thalon Mercrow
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Post by Thalon Mercrow » Wed Apr 02, 2008 7:03 pm

*bow chica bow chica bow wow*

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Post by Bhaern Quel » Sat Apr 12, 2008 5:25 am

It is not that Ed refuses to answer deity questions it is more that how can any mortal explain all about a deity, after all Ed is mortal. So it rends to be his answers are about how he designed them, as oposed to having to explain why they did something. Espcially when he had no control of what they did. Ed does not control what is said about events in the Realms, at best his advise is considered (clearly not always followed).

Drow fertility clerly has come up from time to time and because the topic not well address there is limited data.
Drow are much more fertile then the fair (Surface Elves) having as many as 10 children (one source), can give birth every three years or so appears to be implied in other sources. There again what Lolthian Drow wants to be pregnant most of the time (and basic lore was always written for the dominate rellgion).

We only get bits and pieces when seeking Eilistraee information on how they differ from the "Normal" Drow.

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Post by Dostrealt » Tue Jul 15, 2008 12:39 am

[quote="Velve":3tm53fpa][quote:3tm53fpa]
(I have always found it odd a subterranean race was dark considering most cave dwelling creatures are blind and white :lol:)[/quote:3tm53fpa]

Well if evolution had delt a change in them it would have likely made them look pale, yes, but it wasn't evolution that did that. As said, it was the curse Lolth brought on them.

EDIT: and sorry to go against you Shirle but the 'curse' is the one I have always heard about, so I just think of it that way. ;)[/quote:3tm53fpa]

Serath En'Sendaran has already mentioned (on page one of this thread) the fact that the Illythiiri were dark skinned before Araushnee turned them against the Seldarine. But I think that the first sentence of the drow blurb on page 13 is very interesting:

[quote="Elves - Drow - page 13 FRCS":3tm53fpa]Descended from the original dark-skinned elven subrace called the Illythiiri, the drow were cursed into their present apperances by the good elven deities for following the goddess Lolth down the path to evil and corruption.[/quote:3tm53fpa]

I find that very interesting, because to me it says: drow were already black.

So whatever this curse is, it didn't involve a colour change. So what is different:

[list:3tm53fpa]
[*:3tm53fpa]They have very pale eyes and light sensitivity and[/*:m:3tm53fpa]
[*:3tm53fpa]They are shorter and thinner than other elves.[/*:m:3tm53fpa][/list:u:3tm53fpa]

There are other differences between drow and other elves, but nothing that [b:3tm53fpa]I[/b:3tm53fpa] would say is a "curse".

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Valyrula Olath Drathir
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Post by Valyrula Olath Drathir » Thu Mar 31, 2011 7:20 am

I found lot of answers really interesting! *.*

but... the title of this Topic, makes me thought about "good drow" marriage... can i ask you what you think/found/know about marriage, for the Eilistraee's Drow?


ps: ehr... Venduì to everyone, my first post here... :D i just beg your sorry for my bad english... :/ :'(

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Post by veraka » Thu Mar 31, 2011 7:46 am

Welcome to the boards, and. . .ehh <looks around for Talwyn or Shir'le> not to be the bad rep, but I don't know if I'm the best one qualified to answer that question, but since we're on this, I'll give it a shot.

While most drow(Lolthite) don't have much regard to marriage as a concept, for obvious reasons, goodly drow, might, MIGHT be somewhat different on account of two things; first off, they are likely to have the same approach to marriage as their surface cousins in the regard that drow live just as long as other surface elves, if not longer, in that, they view being tied down to someone for a few centuries more of a burden and hindrance than anything else. This is due in part to drow's natural longevity, akin to all elven-kind.

That being said, they might be likely to keep marriage more to a personal level, giving basis to the individual good drow versus as a whole. This could be in part due to the fact that Eilistraeen drow, view sex in the same way that their Lothite counterparts do, as means to their own gratification. HOWEVER, they differ in the way that most faithful of the Dark Maiden try and find their mate that they have the best kinship with or have known the longest throughout their lifetime. This is my second point that I was going to make.

However, Don't take my word for it, since I'm only scratching the surface of drow knowledge. For more info, I'd speak to Shir'le; Where is the High Priestess?
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Shir'le E. Illios
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Post by Shir'le E. Illios » Thu Mar 31, 2011 9:52 am

I don't know, I'm sure we stashed her somewhere around here... oh wait.

Regarding Eilistraeen weddings, as posted in another thread Ed Greenwood has given [url=viewtopic.php?t=1918:3q8p51mn]a detailed description[/url:3q8p51mn] of Eilistraeen wedding ceremonies. Definitely worth a read.

For the rest it's all personal opinions. I'd think that Eilistraeen marriages would be a lot more based on love (than those of Underdark drow). Beyond that individual views on marriage are probably as diverse as the individuals having them. For some views would be a lot closer to those of Underdark drow I'd imagine (particularly those just newly joined from some Underdark community). Others would be very unbound and flitter from partner to partner without need or desire to be 'tied down'. And yet others would look for a live-long mate to share the rest of their live with. Above all though I think Eilistraeens would be accepting of any diverse views.

Of course, being made up of mostly Chaotic-aligned individuals I'd also expect more to prefer freedom over being in a committed relationship.

As you can see from the text linked above as well as other texts, Eilistraeens also tend to be fairly sexually liberated. I'd imagine that they would see no need for a committed relationship to engage in sexual activity, not if all involved are willing and understanding at least (as would be in all cases; it requires no less willingness and understand to have a monogamous relationship for example). Again this stems from a sense of freedom and acceptance.

Children I would expect to be mostly a responsibility for a community, where the community as a whole raises children instead of just the parents. Though children might be closer to their parents (particularly their mother) than one would expect of Underdark drow, I don't think that there is any family structure or such to raise children and thus the community as a whole takes the responsibility. Particularly if you consider the previous paragraph the father and mother might have engaged in sexual activity without any further commitment to each other. Having the community raise children also takes the burden off of the mother doing so and thus a child can always be a celebrated thing (even if neither of the parents wish to raise a child themselves directly).

Of course things might differ widely from Eilistraee community to community as I don't think that there is any general rule governing all of them; communities can be widely different and have completely different, even opposing, approaches to things. Communities tend to be fairly small, scattered about widely and have (in my perception) very little communication between them and that makes each community more a reflection of the individuals making them up than some wider truth about how Eilistraeens are. But I think that as a general rule the above makes a decent starting point.

Of course, again, except for the text Ed Greenwood posted everything is my personal views, pretty much thought up as I wrote them above.


And welcome to our forums, Valyrula. I hope that my views were helpful and I hope that you may find a home of sorts here. :)


Love -x-x-x-

Shir'le
F'sarn natha tithaur wun l'su'aco.

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Valyrula Olath Drathir
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Post by Valyrula Olath Drathir » Thu Mar 31, 2011 10:10 am

uhm, fairly sexually liberated and children are not a burden... sounds funny :D

Anyway, your point of view is so similar to mine. Thank you really much! The link above is also so much intresting i was looking for something similar!

Thank you for the warm wellcome! :) ... i am sorry if i had make a quesiton on something alredy explained... :-[ i'm still orienting... :P love this site!

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