Help with a D&D 5e Paladin Oath

Since the Chosen of Eilistraee is a religious oriented player group, naturally there is a place to have theological discussions. That is in-game religions; please leave real-world religion out of it. Debate the fine points of a certain dogma, how a church can enforce worship while staying true to its tenets or simply why one deity is better than another one is. All are free to talk about it here.

Moderators: Shir'le E. Illios, Bhaern Quel

Post Reply
User avatar
Nightbreeze
Maid
Maid
Posts: 15
Joined: Sun Apr 30, 2017 6:10 am

Help with a D&D 5e Paladin Oath

Post by Nightbreeze »

I'm currently playing a Moon Elf Ranger who's an Eilistraee follower and I want to create an Oath that's an offshoot of the Darksong Knights. I have the basic stats worked up but I'm having trouble with coming up with a name, as of right now I'm calling it Oath Of The Hunters Moon.

This faction of the church focuses mainly on hunting down enemies of the faith therefore the beauty, song and dance aspects of Eilistraee's faith don.t really come into play with them just the hunting, moonlight and swordplay aspects. Is this something you think the church would allow?
Bhaern Quel
Demigod
Posts: 2103
Joined: Tue Feb 14, 2006 10:32 pm

Re: Help with a D&D 5e Paladin Oath

Post by Bhaern Quel »

Well you do have a problem with hunting enemies. The oath should be more about hunting down evil foes of the faith.

Part of the Dogma is "Strangers are your friends. The homeless must be given shelter from
storms, under your own roof if need be. Repay rudeness with kindness.
Repay violence with swift violence, that the fewest may be hurt and
danger fast removed from the land."

Your paladins are about protection and dealing with evil, not all that oppose the faith are evil. Many do not understand the faith or believe it to be something else.

I think you need more then just hunting, moonlight and swordplay aspects that in part you need to add protection of the innocent (believer or not). Dance, song should at least be known by all followers as those are ways to pray to Eilistraee.
User avatar
Irennan
Champion
Posts: 703
Joined: Thu Nov 24, 2011 5:13 pm
Location: Italy

Re: Help with a D&D 5e Paladin Oath

Post by Irennan »

Your oath sounds like an Oath of Vengeance. The kind of paladin that hunts down the enemis of his religion and so on. Eilistraee doesn't really reflect that, but there's an oath that seems to be crafted just for her, and that's the Oath of the Ancients.

You're right that Darksong Knights are more gloomy than the standard Sword Dancers, but--as Bhaern said--they're still followers of Eilistraee, and should still first and foremost try to build a strong relationship between the drow and other races (therefore lending their help and protection to people in danger, even when not of your faith or friendly towards it), and to help all the drow to rediscover the kindness and love that they were denied, and to forge their place in the surface world. They should still nurture beauty when they have the chance, because if you're focusing just on killing, then 1)you're getting away from what Eilistraee is about 2)what exactly are your fighting for?

The only kind of enemy that the Darksong Knights mercilessly hunt down are the demonic servants of Lolth (they were in fact founded to kill yochlols, and are especially active where Ilythiir used to be). People should never killed and hunted just because they are not friendly to the faith of Eilistraee. In short, I think that you should mix the hopeful elements from Eilistraee's ideals with some elements from the Oath of Vengeance. While playing your paladin, be sure to display the fervor that you'd expect from a Darksong Knight, but remember that they are still about helping people.
Mathematics is the art of giving the same name to different things.
User avatar
Nightbreeze
Maid
Maid
Posts: 15
Joined: Sun Apr 30, 2017 6:10 am

Re: Help with a D&D 5e Paladin Oath

Post by Nightbreeze »

I agree wholeheartedly with both of your suggestions and I planned to incorporate the protection aspect into the Oath I also changed the name to Oath of The Moonsword Knights I decided to call it this because the faction is named after Eilistraee's weapon, thats what these Knights see themselves as they see themselves as living representations of The Moonsword. Here's what I have so far in terms of stats I'm still working out the Tenets though. if you two could help me on this I'd really appreciate it.

Also in terms of the hunting of the enemies of the church this faction would only hunt and protect people from the groups, people and things that are Eilistraees actual enemies as well as followers of Malar who this faction sees as an enemy of all good aligned people period and they also work closely with the churches of Eilistraees allies as well as the church of Vhaeruan because he's now counted as one of her allies. One of the things they strive to do is to get Vhaeruanites to turn Chaotic Good because they believe that if enough of his followers do this then he will eventually follow suit and fully join his sister as a good aligned deity.


Oath Of The Moonsword Knight

Requirements: at least 3 levels in Ranger with either the Hunter or Inquisitor Conclave archetype.

Abilities & Drawbacks


3rd level
Weapon Master (Swords) Feat,
Spell Like Abilities #/day equal to your CHA mod (Eilistraee's Moonfire, Magic Missile)
Faerie Fire At Will

Curse of Penance: Upon taking the Oath of the Moonsword the Oath bearer takes upon him/herself a curse of Penance and vows to give up the use of a bow in combat and accepts the chance that healing potions could potentially do harm to them.

His/her bow and arrows are burned then the ashes are mixed with a magical ink, the ink is then used to tattoo the insignia of the Moonswords, a silver bastard sword outlined against a orange-red hunters moon with extending black filaments, the black filaments were used to pay homage to Eilistraees Brother Vhaeruan who's followers the Moonsword Knights consider brothers in arms.

The tattoo is usually placed on either the back of the knights wrists, the back of the hand or on the back of the neck.

This magical tattoo grants the Knight a permanent effect similar to a Protection From Arrows spell but it also curses the knight with the inability to use a bow for anything other then hunting game for food. Upon using a bow in combat the Knight must make and pass a Wisdom Saving Throw in the beginning of combat or suffer the effects of a Bestow Curse spell equal to his/her own current spell level. Even if the Knight passes the save the attack is made at a Disadvantage.

The use of Healing Poitons is affected by this curse in that whenever a knight uses one there is a 50% chance that the potion will have an opposite affect therefore acting as a poison of the Dms choosing. Aside from this affect the Knight is rendered completely immune to all magical diseases and poisons (either magical or natural) with the exception of those potentially caused by imbibing a healing potion.


(the following ability I took from the Darksong Knight 3.5 class on the D&D wiki and just changed it a bit to fit 5e rules)

One with The Sword: A Moonsword knight can attune his/herself to a particular sword (magical or not or weapon set if two-weapon fighting feat is used),
a process that takes one tenday. During this time she/he must be wearing or holding the sword for at least 8 hours each day, and if interrupted she/he must start again.
She may only be attuned in this fashion to one sword or weapon set (she/he must always use the same off hand weapon) at a time.
Beginning the process of attuning another sword negates the ability of the currently attuned sword. Once attuned to this sword, whenever she/he wields it the sword
grants advantage on any attack made against an enemy of the Eilistraeen faith and +1d6 per level bonus to damage rolls and advantage on saving throws against
mind-affecting spells and effects. If this ability is applied to a dancing sword, the dancing sword gains the attack and damage bonus, but the saving throw bonus still applies to the
wielder of the sword





7th level
Spell Like Abilities #/day Equal to your CHA mod (Moon Bolt, See Invisibility)
User avatar
Irennan
Champion
Posts: 703
Joined: Thu Nov 24, 2011 5:13 pm
Location: Italy

Re: Help with a D&D 5e Paladin Oath

Post by Irennan »

Faerie Fire and the attuned sword fit Eilistraee. The vow to not use bows is also a nice homage to her. I however don't like healing potions having potentially negative effects, and the fact that wielding a bow inflicts a curse. That's because it's not Eilistraee's way to punish her followers like that, especially for no apparent reason. I'd suggest to simply remove their proficiency with bows, and to let these knights use healing potions as normal.
Mathematics is the art of giving the same name to different things.
User avatar
Nightbreeze
Maid
Maid
Posts: 15
Joined: Sun Apr 30, 2017 6:10 am

Re: Help with a D&D 5e Paladin Oath

Post by Nightbreeze »

The curse and healing poiton thing is a reference to Eilistraees history and her vow to give up using a bow because of what Lloth did to her during her rebellion (misdirected her arrow to make it hit her father then tricked her into giving him a poisoned healing potion).

When the Order of The Moonsword Knights were formed they decided to take up these vows to take on and pay penance for the guilt Eilistraee felt over the ordeal. Eilistraee herself isn;' the one who created the curse, that came from the few former Vharaunite Nightshadows who converted during Vhaerauns death when Eilistraee had taken up his portfolio and then they helped form the order. They did it as a way to both pay for Vhaeruans past crimes against the Eilistraeen faith as well as to show their commitment to the faith itself.

The curse is something I think should be in there but what if I changed it so only Full blooded Drow who are former Vhaeruanites have to take on the curse either that or make it so everyone who joins the order still does but it only lasts for a certain amount of time sort of like a rite of passage type thing, like the curse is a sort of trial or something.
Bhaern Quel
Demigod
Posts: 2103
Joined: Tue Feb 14, 2006 10:32 pm

Re: Help with a D&D 5e Paladin Oath

Post by Bhaern Quel »

I do not see in history that Eilistraee gave her Father a healing poison, only that he arrow was misdirected by Lolth injuring her Father. For that matter having just shot someone it appears unlikely anyone would let the daughter that close to finish the job. All the deities also can cast healing spells.
She also gave up all missile weapons as far is that goes.

I am also troubled about a curse effect and clearly would remove the part about healing potions totally.
User avatar
Nightbreeze
Maid
Maid
Posts: 15
Joined: Sun Apr 30, 2017 6:10 am

Re: Help with a D&D 5e Paladin Oath

Post by Nightbreeze »

It's right here but I just noticed that Eilistraee didn't give him the potion, Lloth did, but Eilistraee made the poison.

http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Eilistraee

It was then that Araushnee, faking grief, put in motion the second part of her plan (as she had intended for the invaders to be defeated). Pretending to do her best to save her lover, [b:1o5xa72s]she tried to use a concoction of poisonous herbs, prepared by Eilistraee for the arrows of the mortal dark elves, to finish Corellon, passing it for a healing elixir made up of water from Elysium and healing herbs. She hoped that if her treachery was uncovered, she could still blame Eilistraee, as the potion had been her work.[/b:1o5xa72s] This plan didn't go well: Sehanine Moonbow had in fact managed to free herself, and intervened in time to save Corellon (together with Aerdrie Faenya and Hanali Celanil, in the form of the triune goddess Angharradh) and free Eilistraee from guilt.
User avatar
Irennan
Champion
Posts: 703
Joined: Thu Nov 24, 2011 5:13 pm
Location: Italy

Re: Help with a D&D 5e Paladin Oath

Post by Irennan »

[quote="Nightbreeze":c0dp55gw]The curse and healing poiton thing is a reference to Eilistraees history and her vow to give up using a bow because of what Lloth did to her during her rebellion (misdirected her arrow to make it hit her father then tricked her into giving him a poisoned healing potion).

When the Order of The Moonsword Knights were formed they decided to take up these vows to take on and pay penance for the guilt Eilistraee felt over the ordeal. Eilistraee herself isn;' the one who created the curse, that came from the few former Vharaunite Nightshadows who converted during Vhaerauns death when Eilistraee had taken up his portfolio and then they helped form the order. They did it as a way to both pay for Vhaeruans past crimes against the Eilistraeen faith as well as to show their commitment to the faith itself.

The curse is something I think should be in there but what if I changed it so only Full blooded Drow who are former Vhaeruanites have to take on the curse either that or make it so everyone who joins the order still does but it only lasts for a certain amount of time sort of like a rite of passage type thing, like the curse is a sort of trial or something.[/quote:c0dp55gw]

Ah, that changes things. You should include that the former Vhaeraunites cursed themselves, and that the order was founded by former Nightshadows, in the description.

Still, I don't think Eilistraee would be pleased with that. She believes in redemption through action (i.e. doing good, actually changing), not through punishment, she would already be overjoyed to see drow who were formerly enemies of her people now united with them. She wants to see drow embrace life, punishments just are not her way (I mean, the worst that she does when she's really pissed, is making you lose all artistic inspiration for a time, to let you understand that you're messing up). I think that Eilistraee would also really dislike the part about potions potentially becoming poison, because that could easily take lives, and because the concept is something that goes against her beliefs: an item that may represent the last hope of a dying drow that has given themselves for her cause, turning into a coup 'de grace, is rather cruel and twisted. Some may even see it as a mockery of hope. It also seems strange to me that drow with a practical mindset like former Vhaeraunites would intentionally impair their chances in combat.

That said, she doesn't control the actions of her people, so if the founders of the order have such a rooted belief, and if you think that it is an integral part of your order's flavor, then go for it (but many other followers of the Dark Dancer would be puzzled by them).
Mathematics is the art of giving the same name to different things.
User avatar
Nightbreeze
Maid
Maid
Posts: 15
Joined: Sun Apr 30, 2017 6:10 am

Re: Help with a D&D 5e Paladin Oath

Post by Nightbreeze »

Ok I got an idea here's what i'm gonna do i'm keeping the Curse thing but i'm making it so at first the curse only affects the person who takes the oath but at 5th level the oath taker can project the curse onto an enemy how it will work is this.

The Knight projects his curse to a foe that's about to fire on one of his companions and it causes the arrow to hit him instead of it's intended target and since the Knight has Protection From Arrows he only takes a small amount of damage while the person who fired the arrow has to make a wisdom save or be cursed for 1d6 rounds. So in turn the curse eventually turns into something the Knight can use to protect people.

The healing potion thing I'm changing altogether instead of healing potions hurting the Knight I'm making it so the Knight can turn poison into something that heals they can turn a poison potion into a healing potion and use poisonous plants to create healing slaves and whatnot not only that but he whenever he heals someone whos been poisoned he gives that person immunity to that kind of poison and a regeneration effect for a small amount of time.
User avatar
Irennan
Champion
Posts: 703
Joined: Thu Nov 24, 2011 5:13 pm
Location: Italy

Re: Help with a D&D 5e Paladin Oath

Post by Irennan »

[quote="Nightbreeze":198vr4cy]Ok I got an idea here's what i'm gonna do i'm keeping the Curse thing but i'm making it so at first the curse only affects the person who takes the oath but at 5th level the oath taker can project the curse onto an enemy how it will work is this.

The Knight projects his curse to a foe that's about to fire on one of his companions and it causes the arrow to hit him instead of it's intended target and since the Knight has Protection From Arrows he only takes a small amount of damage while the person who fired the arrow has to make a wisdom save or be cursed for 1d6 rounds. So in turn the curse eventually turns into something the Knight can use to protect people.

The healing potion thing I'm changing altogether instead of healing potions hurting the Knight I'm making it so the Knight can turn poison into something that heals they can turn a poison potion into a healing potion and use poisonous plants to create healing slaves and whatnot not only that but he whenever he heals someone whos been poisoned he gives that person immunity to that kind of poison and a regeneration effect for a small amount of time.[/quote:198vr4cy]

I really like this, it's much more fitting this way.
Mathematics is the art of giving the same name to different things.
User avatar
Nightbreeze
Maid
Maid
Posts: 15
Joined: Sun Apr 30, 2017 6:10 am

Re: Help with a D&D 5e Paladin Oath

Post by Nightbreeze »

Yea what I'm gonna do is make the poison thing work like this, it'll be like a Lay on Hands effect that only works on others, the Knight can reverse the effect of poison or disease, for example if a poison does damage to STR after the knight uses the ability it'll not only cure the poison but it'll give the person immunity to it for a short amount of time and it'll give them a bonus to STR, if it takes HP away incrementally it'll therefore give the person a regeneration effect.

But the Knight can only use the ability on others it wouldn't work on himself because Moonsword Knights are already immune to all poisons and diseases.

The bow thing would be the curse on themselves still exists and they can't use bows in combat. If they do then they do so at a disadvantage and if they roll a critical fail then they suffer the effects of a Bestow Curse spell. This would only last until 5th level after that the Knight gains the ability to direct the curse onto an enemy but the Knight can only use it on enemies that fire on one of his fellow party members not on himself.

The effect would be just like that of a Arrow Catching shield in that the knight would be able to become the target of an attack that was directed at someone 5 feet away from him not only that but both he and the original target would gain +2 to AC and the attacker would have to make a WIS save or suffer the Bestow Curse effect.
Post Reply