DDO vs Neverwinter (long and aggressive)

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Kaote Bruchedaine
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DDO vs Neverwinter (long and aggressive)

Post by Kaote Bruchedaine »

I just posted this on Reddit and I expect it will get deleted due to tender soft feelings being bruised. I suspect this place is much more mature and I won't get in trouble for being honest and aggressive.

[quote:c18k75ey]DDO by a landslide

Neverwinter is the autistic cousin of D&D where the simple minded go.

Even a master of DDO with a perfect group that never makes mistakes still takes between a week and a week and a half to hit level cap.

In Neverwinter it takes two or three days depending on lag.

In DDO it's pretty difficult to make a character that can't do it's job. Primarily because you define what your job is and as long a YOU know your character, it's playable.

In Neverwinter all the classes are pretty linear with very few choices and very little customization.

In DDO it's a gaming experience from start to end and all the content is well spread out with plenty to do and explore all over the place from level 1 to level 28.

In Neverwinter 90% of the game takes place only after you hit level 60, a level that in D&D terms marks you as strong enough to punch AO, the overgod, in the mouth and laugh in his face.

In DDO character choices matter as much as gear. A terribly made character with great gear is awkward, but playable. A great made character with terrible gear is awkward, but playable.

In Neverwinter your character design choices don't matter much at all but having gear is not only critical but is the key to several gamegates. A level 60 character will have some awkward toughness with level 5 mobs if naked. But when you get to level 60 all the new quests are actually gatelocked until you have X amount of gear points you can't progress. So you HAVE to grind out that first couple dungeons repeatedly to get those rare drops before you can even enter the next couple quests.

In DDO there are multiple crafting systems, none of which define the game, but all of which add to the experience and are useful.

In Neverwinter the crafting system serves as a cash sink and a distraction because if you do a single quest a day and start all of your facebook-esque crafts both when you log in, and when you log out each day, you will still out level anything you can craft.

DDO's idea of difficulty is diversity with a mix of unpredictability. Including puzzles, random bosses, the new champion mobs, and some class specific hurdles that surely make quests easier but are not absolute requires as well as a great many of options to reward group play.

Neverwinter's idea of difficulty is to toss you into a generic story with stupidhard mobs with AoE attacks, HP bars in the millions, sweeping attacks, and high recovery rates inside of a tiny confined room... and that's all while you are on your way to the boss.(Some exaggerations includes)

DDO's idea of promoting community play and group play includes includes diverse dungeons that require a wide array of skills to run optimally. In addition there is a leveling guild system with airships that include buffs and expandibility to give a player a measure of pride and the ability to show off their word and dedication.

Neverwinter's idea of promoting group play is to give you a generic guild system with no actual useful features and making the dungeon and mobs frustratingly difficult with dismal returns. For example a fighter that's spec'd to the point where he should be punching Kobolds in the face so hard their head comes out their arsehole and should be one shotting most mobs instead is sitting there trading blows with a low end mob for what in P&P would be upwards of 30 rounds of combat only to finish and have to drink a pot and pick which of the other 19 mobs int hat encounter is going to him up next.

On DDO the average group dungeon takes half an hour to run at a relaxed pace.

In Neverwinter the average group dungeon done at a relaxed pace is several hours.

In DDO the average group encounter takes two minutes.

In Neverwinter the average group encounter takes 15 minutes.

In DDO if you fall in a boss fight you can be raised again to continue helping.

In Neverwinter if you fall in a boss fight you are kicked out and have to watch from a penalty box.

In DDO when you die you get a small debuff that wears off in 60 seconds. Dying multiple times stacks these but each layer still wears off in 60 seconds.

In Neverwinter when you die you get an injury that is permanent unless you stand next to a camp fire for several minutes or you eat a consumable.

In DDO the primary currency is a universal currency that comes from chests, market, daily events, market, dismantling gear and all forms of normal play. This currency is also fully tradable and used for all standard transactions both player and NPC

In Neverwinter the primary currency is Astral Shards and is only attainable from grinding out mindless daily quests, completing trashy player made content, or spending real money then trading the item mall currency for astral shards. This currency is not tradable face to face but it used on the auction house to buy items from other players and is used in most NPC transactions.

DDO is an almost soloably game for the high end player. It takes some pretty amazing gear and some very detailed planning as well as very specific cross-class builds but it can be done for everything but a handful of raids. Most quests can be soloed with some propper planning by just about any class but certain places require specific class features to solo them.

In Neverwinter you are best off soloing the first 5% of the game to get to level 60 because finding someone to run with you will take longer than dying and trying over a couple times will. But once you hit 60 and have to run the grindgauntlet it's completely unsoloably unless you want to spend literally a hundred dollars per dungeon to buy over priced under powered heal items from the cash mall.

DDO has a cash mall with plenty of useful things that are reasonably priced most of which have long term lasting effects that make life easier permanently.

Most of Neverwinter's cash mall is choked full of vaguely useful deco, weak refining items, laughable mounts, and weak hirling junk.

In DDO the hirling vendors are all over the place and they have hirlings on a per level basis. The hirlings are generally only good for an hour but it's lore safe (Hiring a merc for one job) and they are pretty cheap. Usually you will loot enough gems to sell after the quest to have covered the cost of a hirling. A hirling unfortunately takes up a party slot. Hirlings have access to most spells and abilities a character/class of that level would have. One normal hirling can be out at a time and gold seal hirlings, purchased from the cash mall, don't count against that one hirling limit. Party is still capped at 6 players and hirlings count as a player.

In Neverwinter most hirlings cost real money. They are permanent and they level up with you. The most basic hirlings, called companions in Neverwinter, cost 2 gold which for a new player will take till roughly level 30 to make if you are playing alone without help. If you have a veteran to play with they can give you tons of gold easily because gold has almost no use at all in neverwinter. These hirlings have a cap at level 20, which you then need a month's supply of astral shards (grinding all the garbage daily until you brain cells die) or drop 20 dollars to sell the resulting points. The companions on the cash mall cost between 8 dollars and 25 dollars and are of varying quality. Higher quality have higher caps, lower quality means spending more and more money to raise the caps or grinding for months on end to raise the caps ingame. Most companions have one passive ability and two active abilities, one of which is unlocked at much later levels. Companions do not count against player party limits and every player can bring their own.

In DDO quest difficult scales to a limited degree to adjust to party size. A hirling only counts as half a player for the purpose of party scaling.

In Neverwinter it doesn't matter if you go in solo without a companion or if you enter with a full party and everyone has a level 60 companion with them, the quest difficulty is all the same.

In DDO if you could magic away all the mobs and run the empty dungeons they still include puzzles and traps and tricks to be explored that include both skill and ability score tests. There are still ways to die, still bonuses to get, and still a considerable measure of satisfaction for most builds.

In Nevertwinter if you could magic away all the mobs the most sophisticated dungeon (I know of) would have 3 buttons for you to push and that's all there is to it. The traps I've encountered are all so weak a naked wizard could dance in them and the most we have to fear is him discovering a new fetish we didn't know he had.

In DDO if you have a hard time with a dungeon and you give someone some items afterwords they thank you.

In Neverwinter if you try to give someone something after a bad run they take it as an attack on their person.

In DDO a significant portion of the items on the cash mall can be looted from chests ingame including 12 hour +30% exp potions, permanent +3 skill tomes, +2 ability tomes, and many other things. Plus you have a daily chance to get these items. Some of these items can have permanent impacts on your game that will be felt for years to come.

In Neverwinter they give out one laughably small gift box once every few months with low end consumables that likely won't have any lasting impact on your game that will even be felt at the end of the day they are given out and surely nothing that will last more than a couple days.

In DDO to earn free access to the cash mall you must simply play the game in a normal fashion. Finishing quests provides a limited amount of favor and as the favor bar fills up there are a great many milestones that result in free points being given to you. Favor is tracked per character but the points are account wide meaning more characters played actively results in more points.

In Neverwinter the only ways to earn the astral shards that can be converted into cash mall points is to grind out repeating missions over and over and over and over and over and over again.

In DDO endgame is what you want it to be. You can rebirth your character and play the same character through all classes and go for completionist while keeping all the bonuses from all yoru tomes and feats as you reclass and level again and again.

In Neverwinter endgame is running a gauntlet of repeating quests over and over and over to try to get the items to qualify for the next repeating quest. There is also the added bonus of dumping seemingly infinite resources into a facebook style achievement tree to unluck various simple items that will give you access to move stuff to grind and eventually will unlock a new set of dungeons you have to repeat over and over and over to get more stuff to sink into these achivement trees.

Most DDO events are reoccuring events that come around a couple times a year each time with a bit of new stuff. They are all perfectly free to take part in and in most cases offer some new neat stuff that you can upgrade and improve by playing the event.

Most Neverwinter events are again focused on sinking resources into achivement trees and drop tons of inventory clogging boxes that require spending cash mall points to open.

In DDO in order to progress you need to complete roughly half the quests in the game once.

In Neverwinter in order to progress you need to complete almost every single quest once and many of them you will end up having to complete an absurd and vulgar number of times repeating.

In DDO my experience with tech support during a broken quest usually results in a DM popping in to fix the problem.

In Neverwinter my experience with tech support during a broken quest usually results in a DM sending me an email 4 days later suggesting I cancel the quest and start over.

In DDO my most common bug is getting stuck on a ladder piece and having to jump off the ladder to start the whole ladder over.

In Neverwinter my most common bug is a creature getting stuck inside of an object and pounding my face off meanwhile I can't hit him back. This often breaks a quest because a door won't open until all mobs are dead. The next most common bug I've encountered is me getting shoved or tossed over a fence or a wall and ending up inside of side yard of a house or some such thing and can't get out without leaving the quest.

I would say DDO is like instant D&D in a can. It's watered down, but it's a substitute in a pinch like powdered milk. If you are wanting a D&D fix and you are looking at DDO, expect it to be a short term fix but it will hold you over until you can get around a table.

Neverwinter on the other hand is much more like playing streets of rage on 1000% difficulty. It's pure hack and slash with pretty much zero supporting story. If you want a D&D fix and you are looking at Neverwinter nights you would have more fun hitting yourself in the face with a hammer until you are no longer physically capable of pronouncing the name properly.

If you want a diverse exploration adventure that is light on story telling but has good action and a decent pace, try D&D.

If you want a fast paced action combat MMO with very little story and lots of brawling and hack and slash pick up Vindictus.

If you have very low self respect and self esteem and you want to play one of the shittiest games to hit the MMO market as a means of punishing yourself and making yourself lose even more self respect then pick up Neverwinter. It's bad at everything it does and everything it does is bad.

Neverwinter had a lot of potential but Perfect World ruined every bit of it. People like to whine and cry and say I am being unfair to Perfect World and all that jazz. or they like to say Perfect World had nothing to do with it and it's all Cryptic. That's a load of crap.

I played Star Trek Online from launch back when Atari owned Cryptic and it was a great game that fit the Star Trek theme of exploration and diplomacy and all the works. it felt like Star Trek. But as soon as Perfect World sunk their STD infested teeth into Cryptic STO started going down hill hard. It went from puzzled and riddles to stupidhard stuff like it is now. All the new content since cryptic got the game is so grind centric, all the good gear requires getting XXX number of tokens/tickets/crystals/renown/plotlessjunkitem to trade in for an item that's so amazing powerful and awesome that you will replace it with a month of grinding as soon as you get to the very next area. The only thing Perfect World did to improve the entire Star Trek Online game is changed the Tutorial so instead of being a random officer on a random ship you are a student fresh from the academy. Everything else that has been done to STO has been a case of flsuhing it down the toilet and having someone in the sewer with a bucket to scoop it up and what ever they happened to scoop up in the bucket with it is our next patch. The difference for Neverwinter is they did this from the very beginning. Neverwinter never had any gloring days, it was born in that sewer bucket.

Yes this rant got more hostile as it went on, I got more angry the more I thought about it. I am not sorry.[/quote:c18k75ey]


http://www.reddit.com/r/ddo/comments/2v ... verwinter/ the Reddit threat if anyone cares.
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Irennan
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Re: DDO vs Neverwinter (long and aggressive)

Post by Irennan »

I have never played DDO, but I've tried NW and I have to agree with you on the repetitiveness of the game. It's just hack and slash over and over, and the dungeons are only different in that monsters are just bigger balls of stats (and the concept of a dungeon where the boss simply waits for you to kill them instead of moving and setting up ambushes with their minions is very stupid and unrealistic, tbh). It can be fun if you're looking for hack and slash with ''RP'' elements (as in leveling up, degrees of character customization etc), but it reflects many of the negative, dull aspects of MMOs IMHO.

On the comment related to the player base, I can't really agree with you though. You can find annoying/raging/childish/ass people everywhere.
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Re: DDO vs Neverwinter (long and aggressive)

Post by Faediira »

I played Neverwinter...I found it lacking on many levels. I do however play DDO been playing since 2008 and it has its bugs and glitches...and maintenance downtime which everyone complains about all the time even though if they read the terms of agreement they would understand about it better. lol I will not go back to Neverwinter on one of their last updates something broke and wouldn't fix itself so i got rid of it for fear it might be contagious to my computer. DDO at least uses good voice actors and story lines to further along story chains and arcs. There are a lot more affordable items in the auction house and shard exchange than there use to be. ANd through the crafting hall you can create your own magical items even into epic levels. Before I True Reincarnated one of the characters on my account i made sure i got the swords i needed and upgraded them before i put them in the shared bank for that character to retrieve. You don't have to do every single quest in order to true reincarnate or become a completionist to finish the game. The added xp is a perk but only if you do not drink an xp potion and gain xp normally. I could go down the list of my own but it is late and Kaote pretty much covered the basics of both games and my poor eyes are glazing over lol. :D so good night everybody lol
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Shir'le E. Illios
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Re: DDO vs Neverwinter (long and aggressive)

Post by Shir'le E. Illios »

I've tried both games (primarily around beta/launch) and must say that I didn't really enjoy either of them. Maybe it's because I came from Neverwinter Nights, which as far as quest design goes seems superior to both of them (at least in community-made modules).

As such the only thing that really interested me about Neverwinter is its ability to let players make their own quests. Though I also got the impression that the abilities there are very limited with is basically coming down to being limited to creating hack-and-slash dungeons.

But then I've been feeling quite cynical towards MMOs lately.


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