A rightful place awaits you in The Sea of Night

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Dostrealt
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A rightful place awaits you in The Sea of Night

Post by Dostrealt »

Hi,

I just signed up today.

I'm a big fan of the (out of print) Spelljammer Campaign Setting.

I also like drow, but dislike the universal alignment thing* that some early D&D material has.

[i:19wwlu7i]* = By "universal alignment" I mean that "all elves are good and all drow are evil" thing. It isn't realistic to me. I think that races should have tendencies rather than be fixed.[/i:19wwlu7i]

So to me Eilistraee "fixes" drow, by changing them from two dimensional evil monsters into an elf race that chose the wrong side in the war between Araushnee and Corellon Larethian.

(And the "Dark Elves" concept of Dragonlance "fixes" elves, by changing them from two dimensional heroic figures into a race that has individuals who [b:19wwlu7i]can[/b:19wwlu7i] make mistakes.)

Spelljammer has its fair share of good elves turned back (far too many IMO), but doesn't seem to have enough drow turned good.

Some sources (like [i:19wwlu7i]The Complete Book of Elves[/i:19wwlu7i]) even suggest that there [b:19wwlu7i]are[/b:19wwlu7i] no drow in space. But there are a few references to drow in Spelljammer products. One SJ product has a volcano full of evil SJ drow.

Sadly (like a lot of 2nd edition material) it isn't quite enough background to work out what drow in wildspace would be like.

Shadows of the Spider Moon, was a 3rd edition conversion of Spelljammer that swapped the neogi (an iconic evil SJ race) for spacefaring drow. But SotSM stole the ships of the neogi and gave them to drow (instead of creating new drow ships).

So I'd prefer to be a grognard and see a 2nd edition-style drow race in wildspace. I'd like to think that there would be spelljamming clerics of Eilistraee passing on this message:

[list:19wwlu7i][*:19wwlu7i]A rightful place awaits you in the Realms Above, in The Sea of Night. Come in peace and live between the stars, where planets and moons are kissed by the light of the sun.[/*:m:19wwlu7i][/list:u:19wwlu7i]

[b:19wwlu7i]EDIT:[/b:19wwlu7i] By the way, my user name is the name of a drow that hails from Realmspace.

[b:19wwlu7i]EDIT:[/b:19wwlu7i] Spelljamming cleric message tidied up to match my new sig.
Last edited by Dostrealt on Wed Oct 01, 2008 1:24 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Argoth »

A thousand welcomes.
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Post by Shir'le E. Illios »

Greetings and welcome to the forums. May you find a home of sorts here. :)


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Post by Kirintha the Fair »

Im curious any ideas how eilistraee couldfit into spelljammer

When I think of the two together I instantlythink

"seeking out a new homeland"

It suggests in the evermeet sourcbook Kilesk the ambassador, is trying to negoatie for sanctuary, but might not be given it, with apolagies of course.

Why not roam the stars, find some uninhabited world, and settle.

Preferably someplace inside of realmspace.
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Post by Shir'le E. Illios »

The tricky thing with that, I think, is that if [i:10xp93q4]you[/i:10xp93q4] can find an uninhabited world then someone else can too and it's not likely to stay uninhabited for long. And I think you wouldn't want to be so far away as to be completely out of circulation either (you'd still want to be reachable for drow seeking to escape Lolth and such and want to keep contact with the other goodly races).

But in general I do like the idea of escaping to the stars and seeking a new homeworld. :)


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Post by Aylstra Illianniis »

there's a partial answer to this, I think, and it's even canon Realmslore. It seems that Selune is not as barren as everyone thinks. In fact, it is covered by an illusion 9courtesy of Liera before her "death") of being barren and empty, when in fact it is covered by lush forests, and is even inhabited- by ELVES! Naturally, this would make it a great place for a jumping-off point for Eilistraeean drow into Realmspace and beyond, and since it's the moon, her faith would be right at home there. This was brought up (sort of) over on Candlekeep not long ago in the questions to Ed thread, and his answer described the lunar landscape above Toril. (Apparently, someone's PC wanted to be the first elf on the moon, and had no idea that elves already LIVED there, lol!)
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Post by Shir'le E. Illios »

Of course, there's always [url=http://www.spelljammer.org/worlds/locs/ ... l:14hg253y]Evertath[/url:14hg253y]. :)


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Post by Kirintha the Fair »

Sounds like quite the adventure, though

Casting off anchor, and traveling off into the stars, in search of a new home, preferably all young adults, then finding a planet remote enough to claim as yours.

Settling down, and starting a brood.
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Re:

Post by Dostrealt »

[quote="Kirintha the Fair":1uejtyze]Im curious any ideas how eilistraee couldfit into spelljammer

When I think of the two together I instantlythink

"seeking out a new homeland"

It suggests in the evermeet sourcbook Kilesk the ambassador, is trying to negoatie for sanctuary, but might not be given it, with apolagies of course.

Why not roam the stars, find some uninhabited world, and settle.

Preferably someplace inside of realmspace.[/quote:1uejtyze]

Sorry for the lateness of my reply. I did subscribe to my own thread, but must have missed the email notification. :-[

Drow are already in the Spelljammer campaign setting (although they are not a major faction). And Eilistraee is the daughter of Corellon Larethian and Araushnee and was accepted as part of the Elven Pantheon back before Araushnee betrayed her husband and became Lolth. So in ages past, Eilistraee worship would have been acceptable (if not common) across all of Realmspace.

Statistically, the race that became the drow works well in space. They can explore caves inside asteroids or even descend into the [url=http://www.thepiazza.org.uk/bb/viewtopi ... 6:1uejtyze]Underdark within larger asteroids, like The Rock of Bral,[/url:1uejtyze] to find food or build colonies. That race was part of the Elven Navy and the navy used to build/grow special variants of their Man-O-War ships called "Gypsy Moths".

So if the drow were already there, I'm thinking that the Eilistraee worshippers were also already there.

To me the question is, what happened since then? It has been a long time since the Crown Wars. Has Lolth managed to stamp out Eilistraee worship and convert the drow of Realmspace to her faith? Have the other evil drow deities taken over individual drow colonies? Or has Eilistraee managed to hold onto some territory? Sadly, the Spelljammer products didn't get around to giving us an answer.

Given the restricted gods in Dragonlance, I would conclude that Eilistraee is not worshipped in Krynnspace. And given that she is not mentioned in [url=http://www.wizards.com/rpga/downloads/L ... p:1uejtyze]Living Greyhawk Deities v.2.0[/url:1uejtyze] (from the [url=http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=lg ... e:1uejtyze]Living Greyhawk[/url:1uejtyze] page on the WotC website) I would say that she is unknown (or repressed) on Oerth and may well not* be worshipped in Greyspace.

[i:1uejtyze]* = You can not prove a negative hypothesis, so I can not be certain that Eilistraee does not have a faith in Greyspace, but I personally would make her worshippers a cult there, rather than an established and recognised religion.[/i:1uejtyze]

So maybe, rather than seek out uninhabited worlds, the groundling drow of Toril could seek out worlds, moons or asteroids that have colonies of Eilistraee worshippers.

[quote="Shir'le E. Illios":1uejtyze]The tricky thing with that, I think, is that if [i:1uejtyze]you[/i:1uejtyze] can find an uninhabited world then someone else can too and it's not likely to stay uninhabited for long. And I think you wouldn't want to be so far away as to be completely out of circulation either (you'd still want to be reachable for drow seeking to escape Lolth and such and want to keep contact with the other goodly races).

But in general I do like the idea of escaping to the stars and seeking a new homeworld. :)[/quote:1uejtyze]

Undermountain: Stardock (which you can find on WotC's [url=http://web.archive.org/web/200409160233 ... s:1uejtyze]Previous Edition Downloads[/url:1uejtyze] page) features an asteroid in the Tears of Selune (called Stardock) that is connected to Undermountain via a portal. There is no reason why the Underdark of some other asteroids, moons or worlds in Realmspace could not be connected together via portals. Of course, if you have a portal, that would also mean that an agressive faction of drow might try to invade and take over a good drow colony.

I think that the drow of Realmspace would be dug into several secret bases, and would (mostly) be lying low to avoid the Elven Navy (which is a major faction in Realmspace and most crystal spheres in Spelljammer). Some good drow might be working with the Elven Navy, but that would probably be kept secret.

Maybe some good drow ships would operate like corsairs, raiding the ships of evil groups, like slavers**, freeing captives and keeping the loot on the ships they defeat.

[i:1uejtyze]** = The illithids and neogi are two major factions that visit groundling worlds to carry out slaving raids and there is a human slaving organisation called The Chainmen.[/i:1uejtyze]

[i:1uejtyze]Spelljammer: Shadows of the Spider Moon[/i:1uejtyze] has drow using neogi ships and the original SJ material has some drow using spider-shaped ships. But I do think that would seem a bit more like the sort of thing that Lolth worshippers would do. Other SJ material talks about certain ships having domed decks to protect light-hating races (not necessarily drow) from the light of suns. I think that spacefaring Eilistraee worshippers might use a slightly modified version of any ship that elves might use.

There are a lot of option, but most involve an element of guesswork.

I hear that in the novel [url=http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/E ... n:1uejtyze]Extinction[/url:1uejtyze] some non-drow worshippers of Eilistraee have used dye to turn their skin black, but I do not own a copy of that.
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Re: Re:

Post by Bhaern Quel »

[quote="Dostrealt":3nil925u]

I hear that in the novel [url=http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/E ... n:3nil925u]Extinction[/url:3nil925u] some non-drow worshippers of Eilistraee have used dye to turn their skin black, but I do not own a copy of that.[/quote:3nil925u]

From http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20020503a Faiths and Pantheons it provides this [quote:3nil925u] At least once a year, clerics of Eilistraee undertake a Run. Those who are not drow blacken their bodies with natural dyes and oils, and all, drow or not, boil certain leaves and berries to make their hair silvery. They then go wandering on the surface world, trusting to their music, kind ways, and sword skills to keep from being slain on sight. They go where they are strangers, making an effort to seek out elven communities, and bring them game, succor, and helping hands. [/quote:3nil925u]

You do not need to read the novel to confirm non Drow followers exist and sometime darken skin and silver their hair.
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Re: Re:

Post by Dostrealt »

[quote="Aylstra Illianniis":xl2t2cgy]there's a partial answer to this, I think, and it's even canon Realmslore. It seems that Selune is not as barren as everyone thinks. In fact, it is covered by an illusion 9courtesy of Liera before her "death") of being barren and empty, when in fact it is covered by lush forests, and is even inhabited- by ELVES! Naturally, this would make it a great place for a jumping-off point for Eilistraeean drow into Realmspace and beyond, and since it's the moon, her faith would be right at home there. This was brought up (sort of) over on Candlekeep not long ago in the questions to Ed thread, and his answer described the lunar landscape above Toril. (Apparently, someone's PC wanted to be the first elf on the moon, and had no idea that elves already LIVED there, lol!)[/quote:xl2t2cgy]

Selune is as habitable as Toril is. But the natives are totally xenophobic and believe that Toril is gearing up for an invasion. Importing drow from Faerûn to Selene may well be seen as the first wave of an invasion.

[quote="Shir'le E. Illios":xl2t2cgy]Of course, there's always [url=http://www.spelljammer.org/worlds/locs/ ... l:xl2t2cgy]Evertath[/url:xl2t2cgy]. :)[/quote:xl2t2cgy]

Night Druid makes some good stuff. :)

[quote="Kirintha the Fair":xl2t2cgy]Sounds like quite the adventure, though

Casting off anchor, and traveling off into the stars, in search of a new home, preferably all young adults, then finding a planet remote enough to claim as yours.

Settling down, and starting a brood.[/quote:xl2t2cgy]

I actually bought a copy of [url=http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/M ... e:xl2t2cgy][i:xl2t2cgy]Menzoberranzan: City of Intrigue[/i:xl2t2cgy][/url:xl2t2cgy] to try to help me design a spacefaring drow city. Not all of the Tears of Selune are documented in Spelljammer canon, so I might try to locate a small drow town or city inside one of them. I think it could make a good stopping off point.

[quote="Bhaern Quel":xl2t2cgy][quote="Dostrealt":xl2t2cgy]I hear that in the novel [url=http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/E ... n:xl2t2cgy]Extinction[/url:xl2t2cgy] some non-drow worshippers of Eilistraee have used dye to turn their skin black, but I do not own a copy of that.[/quote:xl2t2cgy]

From http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20020503a Faiths and Pantheons it provides this [quote:xl2t2cgy] At least once a year, clerics of Eilistraee undertake a Run. Those who are not drow blacken their bodies with natural dyes and oils, and all, drow or not, boil certain leaves and berries to make their hair silvery. They then go wandering on the surface world, trusting to their music, kind ways, and sword skills to keep from being slain on sight. They go where they are strangers, making an effort to seek out elven communities, and bring them game, succor, and helping hands. [/quote:xl2t2cgy]

You do not need to read the novel to confirm non Drow followers exist and sometime darken skin and silver their hair.[/quote:xl2t2cgy]

Thanks Bhaern Quel. I own [i:xl2t2cgy]Faiths and Pantheons[/i:xl2t2cgy] but only got it fairly recently. That will be very useful for expanding Realmspace.
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