Dungeons & Dragons 4th Edition Announced

Post by **Shir'le E. Illios** » Fri Aug 17, 2007 4:20 pm

I can’t seem to reach the Wizards website to confirm this, but [url=http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/vi ... d:8tr5nzj8]according to the Escapist online magazine[/url:8tr5nzj8] (a news site dedicated to computer games) Wizards announced the fourth edition of the D&D rules at GenCon:

[quote:8tr5nzj8][b:8tr5nzj8][url=http://www.wizards.com/:8tr5nzj8]Wizards of the Coast[/url:8tr5nzj8] has announced the upcoming release of the fourth edition of the legendary [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dungeons_& ... s:8tr5nzj8][i:8tr5nzj8]Dungeons & Dragons[/i:8tr5nzj8][/url:8tr5nzj8] fantasy roleplaying game at [url=http://www.gencon.com/:8tr5nzj8]GenCon[/url:8tr5nzj8].[/b:8tr5nzj8]

Scheduled for release in May 2008, the latest version of the game will feature simplified and faster game play, and will reduce the amount of pre-game "prep time" required. Bill Slavicsek, R&D Director of Roleplaying and Miniature Games at WotC, said, "Fourth Edition streamlines parts of the [i:8tr5nzj8]D&D[/i:8tr5nzj8] game that are too complex while enhancing the overall play experience."

A major change in the fourth edition will be the addition of an online component, known as [i:8tr5nzj8]D&D Insider[/i:8tr5nzj8], which will offer community forums and web-based tools such as an online character generator, Dungeon Master tools and a "digital game table" which WotC says will let gamers "play 24/7 on the internet." The online services, including monthly magazine-style content, will be available for an as-yet undetermined monthly fee.

"At its heart, it's still a tabletop game experience," Slavicsek said. "However, [i:8tr5nzj8]D&D Insider[/i:8tr5nzj8] makes it easier for players to create characters, run their games and interact with the rest of the D&D community."

In the lead-up to the official unveiling, Wizards of the Coast will be releasing two Fourth Edition "preview books" in December and January, titled [i:8tr5nzj8]Wizards Presents: Classes and Races[/i:8tr5nzj8], and [i:8tr5nzj8]Wizards Presents: Worlds and Monsters[/i:8tr5nzj8]. Live demos of [i:8tr5nzj8]Dungeons & Dragons 4th Edition[/i:8tr5nzj8] will premiere at the D&D Experience convention in February 2008.[/quote:8tr5nzj8]
A quick search for other sites listing the news seems to confirm that this is indeed official. Other sites listing it include [url=http://d20.jonnydigital.com/2007/08/wiz ... w:8tr5nzj8]Jonathan Drain’s D20 Source[/url:8tr5nzj8], [url=http://www.progamenews.com/?p=12468:8tr5nzj8]Pro Game news[/url:8tr5nzj8], [url=http://blog.wired.com/games/2007/08/dun ... l:8tr5nzj8]Game Life blog[/url:8tr5nzj8], [url=http://theminiaturespage.com/news/519193/:8tr5nzj8]The Miniatures Page[/url:8tr5nzj8] (which seems to be the direct message from Wizards) and even a [url=http://forums.gleemax.com/forumdisplay. ... 6:8tr5nzj8]Fourth Edition forum at Wizards’ site[/url:8tr5nzj8].

So it seem that it is quite official. There will be a fourth edition in 2008.

As what this means for the Forgotten Realms… [url=http://www.icv2.com/articles/home/11123.html:8tr5nzj8]one article (at ICv2)[/url:8tr5nzj8] notes:

[quote:8tr5nzj8]The setting for the core books are campaign neutral. Forgotten Realms will be the first campaign setting to be updated (in August 2008). Other campaign settings will be updated at a rate of one per year.[/quote:8tr5nzj8]
My guess is that Eberron will be next. But if the core books are campaign neutral does this mean that they’re no longer Greyhawk?

Also, what does this mean for us specifically? Is there anything in the Lady Penitent series that will be permanently changed in the new edition Forgotten Realms? Will they get rid of Eilistraee because they feel good drow are an embarrassment or will they get rid of Lolth and keep her a Greyhawk-only deity? Will Qilu[html]é[/html] rise to be the mother of a new race in fourth edition?

Stay tuned, this bat time, this ba… uh… ahum. I’ll keep you updated as soon as I learn more myself (which could take a while).

At least the D&D Insider stuff could be interesting. Maybe we can actually start holding official D&D games.

[EDIT 20 Aug 2007] Link to [url=http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dn ... e:8tr5nzj8]Wizards' official D&D site[/url:8tr5nzj8]. Seems 4th edition is definitely real.

Love -x-x-x-

Shir'le

Arathen · Post by **Arathen** » Fri Aug 17, 2007 8:23 pm

lol...great, another edition. Well...I'll give it a chance, though I was just getting used to 3.5. Still...that means more books to buy *sigh*

Bhaern Quel · Post by **Bhaern Quel** » Fri Aug 17, 2007 9:08 pm

Previews or at least early comments indicate something like Star Wars saga system (whatever that is).
Weapon types come into play.
There appears to be indication that skill points disappear (skill based on class level instead).

Oh yes it is official, WotC has set up a discussion forum just for 4th edition, there are even YouTube Vids making the official announcement.

Shyressa · Post by **Shyressa** » Fri Aug 17, 2007 10:09 pm

Hmm the Star Wars system uses 2 types of damage totals, Vitality which is your character's ability to turn a direct hit into a graze or near-miss and Wound which is like actual hit points, the amount of damage you can take before going unconscious or dying. You gain vitality per hit die per level like normal classes, and your Wound points equals your Con. Wonder if thats what they are hinting at.. There is still skills in Star Wars, in fact a number of D&D skills and feats are used in Star Wars. Should be interesting I guess, maybe they will release a SRP pack with 4th edition details in the coming months and maybe a pre-release conversion book to give hints like they did for 3.0 and 3.5

Bhaern Quel · Post by **Bhaern Quel** » Fri Aug 17, 2007 10:37 pm

http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=204357&page=1

No conversion pack appears to be planned for, because either the book would be too big or conversion is not posible. At least the above link provides some GenCon answers.

Arathen · Post by **Arathen** » Fri Aug 17, 2007 11:07 pm

From what I've heard, the Star Wars Saga edition scraps the wound and vitality points and goes back to hitpoints, but it seems like they're trying to turn the game into a strange combination of RPG and miniatures game.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Wars_ ... e_Coast%29

I'm not too fond of how much they seem to have simplified it, but I'm going to wait and see the end result before making a final judgement on the new edition.
I admit, though, I haven't tried the new star wars, so...again, I can't really judge either way.

Shyressa · Post by **Shyressa** » Fri Aug 17, 2007 11:12 pm

I agree with you Kaelen, still a long ways before release so who knows if anything said now will stay in the final, so will have to wait and see.

Bhaern Quel · Post by **Bhaern Quel** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 12:18 am

[quote="Shyressa":25ktvv2u]I agree with you Kaelen, still a long ways before release so who knows if anything said now will stay in the final, so will have to wait and see.[/quote:25ktvv2u]

The report is that PHB and DMG are almost final. Granted it clearly is posible for major changes, but odds are low on that.

Arathen · Post by **Arathen** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 8:42 pm

from the official articles on the Wizards website, I'm actually starting to look forward to the new edition.

Bhaern Quel · Post by **Bhaern Quel** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 8:49 pm

[quote="Arathen":15s8rje2]from the official articles on the Wizards website, I'm actually starting to look forward to the new edition.[/quote:15s8rje2]

You like Saga Star Wars?

I am not sold on what I am reading, but different aspects of game design appeal to others that does not appeal to me. All in all though, WotC does not appear to be releasing much at all about the new design.

Magic system changed.
Skill ranks appear to be gone.
Less flexablity of class combinations appear to be in.
Magic item creation appears to be gone, designers deciding they could not come up with a proper system so will leave it to DM to decide how to do it with only advise from designers.

Arathen · Post by **Arathen** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 8:58 pm

well, I agree with a lot of their points in the articles. It seems that it's going to be more flexible, not less...I for one like the idea that mages will actually be able to do what they're supposed to do without being penalized for it.

Bhaern Quel · Post by **Bhaern Quel** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 9:26 pm

[quote="Arathen":2f268ape]well, I agree with a lot of their points in the articles. It seems that it's going to be more flexible, not less...I for one like the idea that mages will actually be able to do what they're supposed to do without being penalized for it.[/quote:2f268ape]

I might need to see what you are reading, because what I am reading is less flexiblity over all.

Yes spell slinging appears will become easier.

But a Wizard is not only there to cast arcane spells any more then the Cleric is there to cast divine healing spells.

Multiclassing will become harder because once you select your first class it appears you remove certain options. No "lame" characters will be makeable. Still do not know what thay consider "lame".

Conversion from 3.X to 4 appears imposible in the views of the design team, though some hint of "artistic conversion" might be provided.

Of course the core classes will at best be 11 based on reports and perhaps as little as 8.

All in all though not enough detail about design is being released yet, so hard to say more flexible or more restrictive to class.

Unen_Stealthfoot · Post by **Unen_Stealthfoot** » Mon Aug 20, 2007 3:49 am

[color=darkred:37l0nuyx]Ooh, yipee. And I just bought three new supplement books.[/color:37l0nuyx]

Post by **Shir'le E. Illios** » Mon Aug 20, 2007 10:28 am

[quote:3pttcuco]Will we be doing ECL?
That’s a good example of something applied to the game to help make somethings work easier. We don’t want to recreate this. We’re not going to give you rules to play a blink dog fighter… There will be many more choices, however, and we want to make sure they are all playable right out of the gate. If say, for instance, we put a tiefling in the PH, we would certainly want to make it playable right out of the gate. So, for example, we might have had to make a lot of the other races a little bit cooler to keep the balance straight between the races.[/quote:3pttcuco]
Yay for that. Byebye ECL.

Of course that could mean they're not doing a drow player race at all anymore, but my guess is (seeing as how popular drow are) that it'll become much more of a standard race (in FR).

Anyway...

I'm not really sure what to think of the system yet. There's a number of things I hear I'm not too happy about (no more skill ranks).

I think they should move away from classes entirely and move to a more free-form character development system. But instead they're keeping classes and are, in fact, focusing more on multiclassing being more viable. I guess that makes sense considering that releasing new classes is what makes them money (and I think people keep being interested in them because no class combination can ever truly capture what you want your character to be).

Still, if they can indeed get it to work that multiclassing works much better and becomes almost an integral part of every character then it might be alright. Key point for me is flexibility in defining characters.

Also the D&D Insider stuff might be alright, depending on how it works. I wonder if it's worth it setting up some of our campaigns there. But it depends a lot on how exactly it works (and how much it would cost).

[quote="Bhaern Quel":3pttcuco]Multiclassing will become harder because once you select your first class it appears you remove certain options. No "lame" characters will be makeable. Still do not know what thay consider "lame".[/quote:3pttcuco]
Actually, I got the impression that multiclassing will become much, much easier. They seem to be dedicated to make multiclassing much more viable. Or, as they say it, a Fighter/Wizard should be a good character and not a crappy fighter and a crappy wizard. In fact I wouldn't be surprised at all if almost every character will multiclass (for example, it wouldn't surprise me in the least if the base classes only have ten levels or so).

Anyway, I can more-or-less reach [url=http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dn ... e:3pttcuco]Wizards' D&D site[/url:3pttcuco] again. Seems to be a number of links for 4E there (that I've still got to check out).

Love -x-x-x-

Shir'le

Argoth · Post by **Argoth** » Mon Aug 20, 2007 10:31 am

To be honest, I don't care about the system. To an extent anyway. The D&D system is too complex as far as we're talking about combat. It's goes on forever to end a very dangerous duel, or stuff like that. I'm interested in the changes done to the world itself. Forgotten Realms without Lolth will be a little, poorer. And without Eilistraee things are starting to piss me off. Anyway I hope Eilistraee AND Lolth stay. They're the main drow deity antagonists. And who will keep the whole Drow civilisation in the Underdark go on? Who'll be the main deity? Ir will the new race brood by Qilue turn the drow into ashes?

I can only pray...